Nourish & Empower

Why Striving For Your Best Beats Chasing Perfect

• Jessica Coviello & Maggie Lefavor • Season 2 • Episode 6

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Perfection looks like safety on the surface: if nothing is wrong, nothing can hurt me. But under the polish sits a heavy cost—anxious checking, shrinking choices, and a relentless inner critic. We open up a candid, compassionate conversation about perfectionism’s roots, how it shows up in food rules and body image, and why chasing flawless outcomes erodes genuine health.

Together, we draw a bright line between being perfect and doing your best. One demands control you can’t actually have; the other honors context, limits, and change from day to day. You’ll hear how perfectionism can function as a trauma response, why high-achieving doesn’t have to mean rigid, and what family and school environments can teach us—sometimes loudly, sometimes subtly—about earning love through performance. We also connect the dots to anxiety and OCD traits, highlighting the telltale cycles of punishment, escalation, and burnout that follow broken rules and “imperfect” choices.

Most importantly, we share practical tools to loosen perfectionism’s grip. Map green, yellow, and red zones to target small, doable experiments. Practice exposure without neutralizing: wear the mismatched socks, leave the bed as-is, eat the “good enough” snack, turn in the assignment without one more pass. Shift your success metric from outcomes to effort and care. For support people, we offer scripts and timing tips that validate fear while inviting change, so encouragement lands where it can help most.

If you’re ready to trade pressure for peace and reclaim self-worth from grades, calories, and checklists, press play. Then tell us: what’s one rule you’re ready to rewrite? Subscribe, share this with a friend who needs it, and leave a quick review to help others find the show.


Trigger warning: this show is not medical, nutrition, or mental health treatment and is not a replacement for meeting with a Registered Dietitian, Licensed Mental Health Provider, or any other medical provider. You can find resources for how to find a provider, as well as crisis resources, in the show notes. Listener discretion is advised.


Resource links:

ANAD: https://anad.org/

NEDA: https://www.nationaleatingdisorders.org/

NAMI: https://nami.org/home

Action Alliance: https://theactionalliance.org/

NIH: https://www.nimh.nih.gov/


How to find a provider: 

https://map.nationaleatingdisorders.org/

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us

https://www.healthprofs.com/us/nutritionists-dietitians?tr=Hdr_Brand


Suicide & crisis awareness hotline: call 988 (available 24/7)


Eating Disorder hotline: call or text 800-931-2237 (Phone line is available Monday-Thursday 11 am-9 pm ET and Friday 11 am-5 pm ET; text line is available Monday-Thursday 3-6 pm ET and Friday 1-5 pm ET)


If you are experiencing a psychiatric or medical emergency, please call 911 or go to your nearest emergency room.


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SPEAKER_03:

Join us as we redefine, reclaim, and restore the true meaning of health.

SPEAKER_01:

Let's dive into the tough conversations about mental health, nutrition, eating disorders, diet culture, and body image. This is Nourish and Empower. This episode is brought to you by Hilltop Behavioral Health, specializing in eating disorder treatment. Hilltop offers integrated therapy and nutrition care in one compassionate setting.

SPEAKER_03:

Their expert team works with you to achieve recovery and avoid the need for higher levels of care. Visit www.hilltopbehavioral health.com because healing happens here. Hi everyone. Welcome to this week's episode of the Nourish and Empower Podcast. Today we are doing an episode all about perfectionism. So trigger warning, we will be discussing eating disorders and mental health today. Listener discretion is advised. As a reminder, this show is not medical nutrition or mental health treatment and is not a replacement for meeting with a registered dietitian, licensed mental health provider, or any other medical provider. You can find resources for how to find a provider, as well as crisis resources in the show notes. Welcome to today's episode. We are excited to get to bring this topic onto the pod. It's something that you know we've had people in the past really mention and want to hear more about. So very excited to hear all Jessica's wisdom today.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah, we're putting me in the hot seat today. Sometimes it makes me a little nervy, I'm not gonna lie. But I am very excited.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah. So I guess like to start, maybe just for the listener, could you sort of define perfectionism just so that way everybody's on the same page of what we're really talking about?

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah. So how I would and like how I think about perfectionism, also thinking about like what my clients bring to sessions, is feeling the need to be the best at everything, feeling the need to not make any mistakes, to not uh have any imperfections, to be, it's just allowing yourself and forcing yourself and believing that you can do this, which you cannot, but it's making yourself believe that you can be the best at every single thing without ever making a mistake or having anybody say, Oh, I wish you were like this, or I wish you did that, or you failed. It's just being this all-encompassing perfect. I don't know if that made sense.

SPEAKER_03:

It made sense. And I think too perfectionism strikes me as a really interesting topic because I think we see it a lot in eating disorder treatment. And I see it a lot as a dietitian when it comes to food rules and having like this perfect day of eating, you know, quote unquote perfect, right? We see it a lot with orthorexic tendencies, right? Like that over-emphasis on clean eating and having these quote unquote perfect ingredients, but you know, it's also a topic and a theme that I think really hits home and resonates for a lot of people outside of eating disorders, too. And so it does make me wonder like why so many people struggle with perfectionism tendencies, and like what are some of the themes that you've seen or you've noticed of like the themes that I guess lead to development of these perfectionism tendencies?

SPEAKER_01:

One that came to mind as you were asking the question is that it's a trauma response. Is that if you are, because if you think about it, right? If I show that I'm perfect, then no one can say anything about me. No one can say anything to me. So a lot of times, too, perfectionism is just a way to kind of stay in your box and to make sure that life and people like you and are easy. And so it's this false narrative that they're giving themselves that says, okay, well, if I if I'm perfect at cleaning the house, I'll never get yelled at by my significant other. If I'm perfect at academics, then my parents can never get mad at me. If I'm perfect at caring for my significant other or being the best type of friend possible, then no one can get mad at me because I'm so perfect that everybody is happy. So no stress is on me. But if we think about it, the amount of stress you're putting on yourself in order to see that you to seem like you are perfect is a heck of a lot of stress. It is not comfortable and it actually does so much more harm to us medically, mentally, emotionally, nutritionally, physically. Like it is just a terrible experience to have. But a lot of people feel safe in the place of how can I be perfect? Because it's a place where they think that it's a place where you think and uh you in certain instances I understand that you are in control, if that also makes sense. Because like obviously, can you be perfect? No. So are you controlling something legitimately by forcing yourself to be perfect? No. However, is your mind uh fixated on I can control my actions here? Yes. So you are controlling yourself, but you're controlling yourself in a way that you can't actually achieve.

SPEAKER_03:

It sounds almost like like armor, like a shield. Oh, yes. Okay, yeah. Would you describe perfectionism as a coping skill?

SPEAKER_01:

So funny you asked that. I would say yes, and I think that's why it intertwines so much with the population that we see, because there are moments where I also understand how an eating disorder is a coping skill. Maladaptive, maladaptive, bad one, no, no. However, do I see how it does help emotionally allow someone to feel more grounded in such a harmful manner? Yes, I do.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, because I think when I was prepping for the episode today and thinking about this and coming up with, you know, some questions, like one of the things that came to mind was okay, playing devil's advocate, like, isn't striving for perfection a good thing? Because I could see somebody, especially somebody who's maybe protective, you know, some of their perfectionism tendencies, kind of counter with that and give that back to you and throw it your way and be like, well, you know, shouldn't I be striving to do the best at everything I can? And so I'm curious what you would what you would say to that.

SPEAKER_01:

So I had such a thought because you just said the word that I always bring up when clients are like, I need to be perfect. There's a difference between striving to be perfect and striving to be your best. They're not the same thing, in my professional and personal humbled opinion. Because to me, if I'm striving for my best, my best is going to be different every day. If I and also if I know that my best, let's take me for example. Science in my brain, we don't go together. Math in my brain absolutely do not go together. So if I'm studying for a math test and my best comes out as a 75, and I know that I worked my butt off, that is my best. I am accepting of that because I know that there was that's just the way the cookie crumbled and the way that where I land with those subjects, that's what's gonna happen. Me trying to be perfect and trying to get a hundred, knowing that I struggle in math, knowing that this was the best outcome for me in that moment, that makes me feel like I failed. When I know that I studied for however many hours, I know I saw the tutors, I asked the questions, I did the things, I did the homework, I felt prepared, and I still got that. That's me doing my best. So if someone's coming to me and they're like, okay, but I want to be perfect and I want to be my best. Well, what does your best look like? And is it different day to day, right? Even thinking about relationships, right? My best to you as a friend and as a like a podcast co-host with you over the weekend, I might be better than during the week. Monday, I could have given you my absolute all, where Tuesday you get 10% of me because 10% is the best that I can do in that moment, and it is what it is. So it's also I challenge that I that rebuttal because doing your best is your best, and it's okay if it's not perfect.

SPEAKER_03:

So what makes the difference then? Like, because let's say for example, I'll give a personal example, right? No surprise here. I I feel like I was a very high achieving like type of student, right? Okay, I feel like that that checks with my personality. Like, you know, was really wanted to do well in school. I mean, I think a lot of dietitians, there's kind of a joke about that of like a lot of high achieving kind of people become dietitians, right? So what's the difference between high achieving and perfectionism? Like, what draws the line in the sand there? Because if somebody were to ask me, would you describe yourself when you were younger as being a perfectionist? I would say no. But if they would say, like, well, were you somebody who was high achieving, I'd be like, yes, absolutely. Like, never missed the day of school, you know, like tried to get really good grades. But I'm curious what that line is.

SPEAKER_01:

So can I, can you be our guinea pig? Yeah. Okay. So what makes it different for you? Because you just said, if someone said, and if someone asked you, are you a perfectionist, you would say no. But you would identify yourself as high achieving. So for you, why wouldn't you put yourself in that category? If you never missed school, if you did all of your homework, if you made sure you got good grades, if you strive to be the best that you could be, technically that could fall under perfectionism, but you're saying no. Why?

SPEAKER_03:

I would say I think acceptance. So, like an example that comes to mind for me is I am terrible at history and memorization, and I have no interest in that subject at all. My freshman year of college, I got both semesters C's in history. I was not a C student. But to me, it was like acceptance of like that's not my thing, and that's okay. And I just like I felt okay about it. I don't know how else to describe it. It was just kind of like, okay, that's not my thing, that's totally fine. And I think too, and this brings me into another question I have for you, but you know, I, which is I think something that plays a big role in this, like, I grew up in a household where, yes, we were encouraged to do our best, but like if I came home with a grade that maybe wasn't my best, like there wasn't, it wasn't punitive, you know. And I think for a lot of people, you know, and I recognize my like being fortunate there, because I think for a lot of people, there is that fear of like, what are my parents gonna say? Am I going to be in trouble? All of that, you know. I mean, with my husband and I now it's like a joke. He took the same history class in college, put in probably a tenth of the effort that I did and easily got an A, right? And for me, I worked, you know, as hard as I possibly could, and like a C was my best there. That's all I was doing. And like, that's fine. I I don't know anything about history, and I don't need to. But my sister, yes, ma'am, go ahead.

SPEAKER_02:

Oh no, I was just saying power to you because my sister is the same, know nothing about history, and we're here, we're okay here.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, we know I'm I I know a lot about one topic, and that is it. Do not ask me a history date, I don't know it. Um, but I think for me, I would say acceptance, but I don't I don't know if that's if that's really the the difference.

SPEAKER_01:

I would say yeah, and thank you so much for allowing me to you know pick your brain there. Vulnerability, it is key, it is beautiful, but it is because like my example of what your best could be different every day. If you know that you worked so hard to get a grade and the grade that you got was not what you wanted, there is an acceptance of, okay, well, I tried. I did everything. It's knowing that you did everything in your power to do the thing. And whatever the outcome was, the outcome was. And you're not berating yourself, telling yourself you suck, telling yourself that you're not good enough, telling yourself that you should have worked better, you should have done better, you didn't do this, you didn't. Perfectionists constantly reel their brain to tell them that nothing they did was good enough. It's constantly telling themselves that you could have done better and you failed and you're a miserable person. And it's really sad, like the narrative and the language that people use in their brains when they are perfectionists, because it's just a it's just a mean thing. You know what I mean? But like I would definitely say that radical acceptance and just saying, like, okay, like it is what it is, is absolutely part of that process for sure.

SPEAKER_03:

So I wonder then, what did you say? You nailed it. Oh, thank you. But I I wonder then to to think back, right? Because I know I had said as I was answering, like, this is bringing me to another question. So when it comes to themes that are leading to these perfectionism tendencies, do you typically see a nature component? Do you typically see a nurture component, or is it kind of a mix of both?

SPEAKER_01:

I would definitely say it obviously, right? Things can be a mix of both. I think if it is a trauma response, it's definitely nurture, right? Because if a client is learning that the way that they can keep peace in the house is if they present a certain way, that's nurture. You are learning how to do certain things and how to present in the house to make sure that things are okay. And I say that in my air quotes because we do not have that much power to be able to conduct and create the energy in the home as a child when we have parents. We are not meant to parentify, we are meant to be the child. And a lot of kids that grow up to be a perfectionist is because they feel like they have to parent. It's because they feel like they have to appease their parents in a certain way. So I definitely see a lot of a lot of the nurture. However, there are some people that just grow up really competitive and it's just in their blood. It ain't me, but it's just in their blood that they have to be the best and they need to strive. And you'll see parents be like, listen, you did your best. It's okay. Like I remember, I hope he doesn't mind that I'm telling the story, but my brother, for instance, was so hard on himself when it came to grades. And I remember there was one day, and this is very much a personality story, where like my brother came home and he was like very visibly upset that he got like a B or a B plus on one of his exams. And my parents weren't like they didn't put a lot of pressure on us to like get straight A's. It was just agreed. It was like do your best. There were always like questions of like, did you do your best? Did you try hard enough? But it was never to like berate and belittle. It was just like curiosity, especially when it came to me because I hated studying. But for my brother, I remember just being like, oh my God, why do you care so much? It's a beef. Like that's phenomenal. And I just remember being like, I don't understand, but he was so upset by it. So to my brother, it was definitely nature because that's your ain't in this body. However, it was also a mix of nurture at the same time.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, yeah, no, and I can see that. And I think too, it brings up as you were talking, what I was thinking of is that nurture is so many different environments. Like it could be the home environment, but the example I was thinking of, so I volunteered for the past 10 years with like this program that my high school puts on, my old high school puts on. And like it's like it's like a one-on-one that I mentor a student. And so for, you know, over the past 10 years, thinking back on it, it's like one of the main themes that comes up is like kind of being at this high-achieving school and you know, just how overwhelmed the students feel because they're, you know, there's grades and extracurriculars and sports, and then they're doing this volunteer thing and they have so much going on. And so we always kind of have this conversation of like, yes, the grades are important, but also no one's gonna remember the grade that you got on the third history test junior year of high school, like it's going to be okay. And some people take that and are like, you're right, like I'm never gonna look back on this, you know, I totally get it. And other people are like, I just cannot imagine like a world where I don't know what this grade was. So I could see the spectrum of it there too. And again, these are people, obviously different nurturing environments when it comes to home and, you know, like other differences, but I feel like to be at the same nurturing environment when it comes to school, but have totally different reactions.

SPEAKER_01:

I do always wonder, right? Because again, some parents might be like, you're doing great. Why are you so crazed about this? But there is just something within somebody's psyche that makes them believe that they have to be so perfect at everything. And I think it is, you know, part of it is insecurities, part of it is wanting to feel like they're in control, right? Like I think there are correlations with people that have that perfectionistic tendency. There's also anxiety embedded there. There is some OCD embedded in there, right? I think that it is encompassed with a lot of other different things, which makes sense also.

SPEAKER_03:

You just read my mind. I was going to ask you what some of the other, like what some of the diagnoses are that you feel like you see perfectionism tendencies with outside of eating disorders. So it sounds like anxiety, it sounds like OCD. So then I guess that brings us to if somebody is looking to challenge perfectionism, what are some of the the ways that they could work on that?

SPEAKER_01:

A lot of times, with you know, I was just saying before, kind of, is that perfectionism is also a piece of like their self-worth. Like, are they good enough if they do this? Are they going to, you know, protect the household if they act in a certain way? And so I'll take the specific of what someone is struggling with, and I will I'll take what someone is struggling with and we'll focus on that specific. But I'll almost do sometimes. You know how we do like the green, yellow, red with our fit clients when it comes to food. So I'll also do that with like where is your anxiety, or even with OCD and even with perfectionism of like what are the areas that you feel like you're okay without being perfect, if there are any, and kind of just see where they absolutely feel like they need to be perfect, and we'll go in the progression of exposure therapy, kind of like through that. But when we're trying to challenge perfectionism, I'd really like to say, like, what makes you believe that your self-worth is embedded in this test, right? Since we're talking about exams. How does your worth define differently from an A plus to an A minus, from a B to a B plus, so on and so forth, just to really understand what it is in their brains that's allowing them to think this way, or what it is that they're believing about themselves? Because what they're doing is that they're projecting their self worth onto that thing, right? So, like in our past episodes, we've been talking about projection at the holidays and like how people are communicating and things like that. Because of how they feel, where they're putting that emphasis, like our clients too, with eating disorders, it's in the number. So is it on the scale? Is it the amount of calories? Is it the exam number like the grade on the exam? Is it on, you know, how many AP classes you're in? Is it how many times you can get someone to smile, or people tell you they love you? Like those things are almost markers and like those measurable goals in my air quotes to what makes them think that they're perfect. So I'll take those and I'll try to understand how they measure themselves within them and then challenge it from there.

SPEAKER_03:

Okay. So so with the green, yellow, red, too, just to explain it in case people aren't familiar. So green is like what you're comfortable with, yellow is what you're willing to explore, red is I can't really touch these right now.

SPEAKER_01:

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Okay. So if it's like, and I do that, I do it more with like OCD, with like what are you willing to challenge with your OCD tendencies, behaviors, compulsions. But also when it comes to perfection, it's really just trying to understand like what do you feel so inherently needing to be perfect about? So if it's not the green, yellow, red, it might be like, okay, what are we like, what are the perfectionism tendencies? Like, can we identify them? Can we name them? And a lot of times, too, clients don't realize how often they're thinking about it. So it's also fun for them. I mean, for me, not really for them, but it's also fun to see how deep it goes for some people. Because they might not realize, oh, I feel like I even need to be perfect in if I have a wrinkle in my shirt, that's not good enough. If I wear two different socks, that's not good enough. Because I know some people don't match their socks, they're just like whatever, right? And but perfectionists, they wouldn't be able to do that. If they don't make their bed, if their bed doesn't look a certain type of way, like it goes into such little details of their lives. So if I can see what is the smallest level of perfectionism to the largest versus the green and the red, that can also help us.

SPEAKER_03:

So I'm kind of curious, then going off of that, if let's say like a support person recognizes that somebody around them is struggling with perfectionism. Is that is it appropriate to talk about? How does that get approached? Like, I also just want to hear a little bit more about what the support here looks like too.

SPEAKER_01:

No, that's great. And I think it's very similar to what we were talking about last in last week's episode about is the client listening or the hearing, or the hearing or they listening, whichever one it is. Because absolutely allow someone to recognize that they are not worth being perfect, that their worth is not embedded in such an unobtainable thing. So if a client is ready to challenge it and is ready to see that they are worth something so much more than just this facade, yes, let's challenge it. Let's show them where their worth lies. Let's show them that they don't need to be perfect to make a home sustainable. You just being a part of it is. Let them know that if they fail an exam, okay, you failed an exam. We'll get over it. It's one exam, right? So it definitely is important when the client is ready. However, it's also important to throw it in there before they're ready to, right? Like obviously, when they come to therapy, they might not be ready to challenge these things, but they're coming to therapy, so we are going to challenge them. So it's learning what are the little moments that we can have a supports person really dive in there and be there for us. And how do we like allow that progression to take course?

SPEAKER_03:

Also, do you think for a lot of people they like the individual has awareness of these tendencies being like perfection? Oh gosh, I'm gonna have such a hard time saying that word, perfectionistic. Do you think the individual has awareness of these tendencies being perfectionistic? Or do you think because there is that nature component, because there could be this use of like these tendencies as a coping skill, is it similar sometimes to the way eating disorders are, where clients are are kind of unaware that like a behavior would be an eating disorder behavior? So is there like an unawareness that a behavior could be a perfectionism tendency?

SPEAKER_01:

It's a really good question. And I feel like I have so many clients bouncing in my head of how we've talked about it. And I think it can be either or. Because to your point, right, people that struggle with eating disorders, they might not sit there and be like, oh, I have an eating disorder because I'm not eating this or because I'm engaging in that behavior. It's like, no, I'm I'm just doing what I know makes me feel better, or I'm just doing what I want to do, right? They don't, if they don't recognize there's a label to it, they're not going to put it there. However, I do know that there are some clients who might be like, no, I'm completely aware of what I'm doing and I understand that I'm trying to be perfect and I can't be, but it's the only thing that makes me get through a day. So I think it depends on I feel like I always say that, depends on the client. But it's true, right? Like I think there definitely are people who can sit there and they can recognize it. I also think that there are people who might have the fleeting thought of you have to be perfect and not necessarily connect to the fact that they are perfectionist. So like I think they have the wherewithal of knowing they're trying to achieve perfect, but they might not recognize or attach to how deeply it is and like identify themselves as a perfectionist too, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_03:

Yeah, yeah. Cause I was the reason I asked the question too is I was thinking more in my context as a dietitian. I feel like where I see perfectionism come in is with food rules. Right. So food rules are, you know, rules that the eating disorder creates that the individual then feels like they have to follow or there'll be a consequence if they break the rules. So, like common food rules are about, you know, like the number of times somebody can eat something in a day, a week, for example, right? Not to be too specific. And I feel like there are times where there is awareness of this is something that I'm thinking about is stressing me out, you know, is changing aspects of my life, is making me feel like I can't go out with friends or, you know, I can't have the things that I want to have. And I also feel like too, I've seen like kind of no awareness around it as well. And then I have to be the one to like lovingly, you know, but also directly kind of explore it a bit more. And for some people, that's I mean, that might be the first time that they've ever connected something to perfectionism, and that can be really challenging because, like you're saying, somebody might have that thought of, you know, I want to do this thing in a perfect way or I have to be perfect, but then not really connect to perfectionism quite yet.

SPEAKER_01:

A hundred percent. And I think too, I think one of the things you said was also really important to note of like that punishment piece, right? Of if I don't do this, then this consequence is or this punishment is going to happen. And I feel like people don't always recognize that is an outcome for a lot of people with perfectionism. I feel like sometimes people just see, oh my God, you're just trying to be perfect, or oh, you're just trying to do this, not recognizing the battle that's going on in their head, the punishment that they then enforce in themselves, and just like the torment that happens with someone, especially when it comes to eating disorders, right? The eating disorder causes someone to have so many rules. And if the rules then quote unquote aren't followed, the amount of pressure and like the amount of negativity they then inflict on themselves, sometimes physically, sometimes mentally, it really does get heavy because the clients feel like they failed, and that failure is just a lot for them to handle. So it does become like that, like a punishment to them too, for not fulfilling that perfectionism.

SPEAKER_03:

And I feel like the interference it brings into life, you know, it can be such a distinguishing factor, too, right? Like we were saying earlier, you know, somebody could be striving for, you know, to get good grades, but also like still going to bed on time rather than like the person who was striving for good grades and like now is staying up all night because they can't fathom going to sleep until they're able to, you know, whatever the achievement is that they're looking to achieve has to be completed.

SPEAKER_01:

Or even if it's, you know, to your point of you know, school again. Okay, so I did so bad on this test and I studied for six hours, so I have to study for eight hours. And if I don't study for eight hours and I fail again, I have to then increase it. It's like their threshold of what it is that they're doing and what they think that they need to do increases. And to your point, some people might be like, okay, well, how is that a punishment? If you're not sleeping, if you are doing it out of force, if you are exhausted at hour three and you say to yourself, No, you failed the last time, or you got a B instead of an A and you have to keep going, that is a punishment by nature, right? It's a punishment by acting. So people don't understand just like the severity of what people go through before, during, and after to achieve and accomplish what it is they want to, obtainable or not.

SPEAKER_03:

So if someone who's listening is feeling like this is really resonating with them, they're feeling like, wow, I'm you know, I do connect to perfectionism. I have a lot of these tendencies. I love when you do this, so I'm putting you on the spot for it. What would you say to them? Like, what would be your your kind of pep talk for them?

SPEAKER_01:

Oh my god, you're great as you are. Stop being so silly. Uh I like it's so sad. But if someone has said that they feel okay, so are you asking, like, what do you say to somebody if they feel like they're perfect? Everything needs to be perfect.

unknown:

Yes.

SPEAKER_01:

Sometimes comprehension is not my forte, so I have to like repeat the question, make sure I know what I'm saying. You don't have to be perfect to be loved. You don't have to be perfect to deserve, you don't have to be tur perfect to achieve. Whatever it is that you are doing in the moment is good enough, and someone is going to love you. And the most important person that loves you is yourself. And so if you are good enough based on the effort you put into something, and maybe the effort is lying on the couch all day and not doing anything. Maybe the effort is studying for five hours for an exam. Maybe the effort is making a meal for six of your friends because you know, you just feel like it. Whatever it is, how big or how little, you are meant to be exactly where you are. You do not have to be perfect, and your best is enough. Just be you.

SPEAKER_03:

That's what I wanted. Thank you. I love when you do that.

SPEAKER_00:

Thanks. This is when, like, the I love when you called yourself a golden retriever because I like felt that so hard. But like these are the moments where I feel that because I'm such a positive patty that people are like, gross, stop it.

SPEAKER_01:

But I just can't help it. Like, people deserve to feel that they are enough, and you don't have to try so hard to have that. Like you and it makes me sad because I do understand that there are families. And I just saw this on an Instagram reel the other day that was like, you know, kids might become perfectionists to make their parents happy, or kids might fail to make their parents happy because some parents are so envious of their children that kids know if they do too well, then their parents aren't going to love them. So they have to fail. Like, there's so many uh intricacies with family dynamics that it definitely causes. I understand why it causes people to become what they are, whether it's perfect to protect themselves or whether it's to make other people happy, maybe a little bit of both. Like I get it. And I just wish everybody knew that you don't have to constantly be in a state of panic, fight or flight, fawn or freeze. You can truly just be you and people will love you for you. You don't have to force yourself to act like someone you're not.

SPEAKER_03:

That feels like the perfect ending spot for today. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Wonderful. We need a little applause. Yeah. Well, thank you. I know we had you in the hot seat today, but super helpful. Always love hearing all your wisdom. And I think that this is this is such a again a topic that I think a lot of people can resonate to in a variety of different ways. So really happy that we got a chance to talk about it. Me too. And we appreciate you know, everybody who voted on episode topics. We always want to hear from you of what you really want to hear us chatting about. We have some really exciting episodes coming up. We have a couple of surprise guests. So keep your eyes on Instagram stories. We're gonna start asking for some questions to ask our guests. We have some really amazing guests coming on to talk about some fantastic topics. Um, and then, you know, we have some episodes with just us coming up too that are some great topics as well. So thank you everyone for listening, and we will see you here next time. Thanks everybody.

SPEAKER_01:

Bye. Bye. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Nourish and Empower Podcast.

SPEAKER_03:

We hope this episode helped you redefine, reclaim, and restore what health means to you.

SPEAKER_01:

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